Looking for Advice from Moms with "Older" ADHD/ADD Children...

Go with the ped. The school will only do the most basic of testing, so 30 minutes tops unless something glaring shows up. Ped can refer you to someone who M. do several days of testing mattering on what they see.

ADHD is not the reason for punching, hitting, kicking, etc. ADHD can cause all kinds of things, mostly the inability to sit like the zombie the schools want them to and the inability to stay on task with what I like to think of as one dimension learning. Sitting and reading a history book is not as engaging as seeing short videos about history on a computer and clicking all the right answers to a few questions, or having a lively discussion about the subject. ADHD children learn different. It's not a license to become angry, beligerent, and hit people.

If you want your son tested so that he can learn differently, great. But if you need to teach him how to behave and can't handle this on your own, get him to a behaviorial therapist.

K.,

My son is now 26, but we had a very rough childhood! He was asked to leave several day cares and expelled from school several times over the years for these types of behaviors. Pedi just prescribed meds, some helped and some were horrible. I took him to an ADHD specialist who did testing over several hours and surveyed his extended family and teachers. We got quite a bit of help from him, but my son was never completely in control of himself. We even took him to a psychologist for a while. He is extremely intelligent, but was always socially awkward. I fully believe that he has Asberger's syndrome. I wish that I had known about Asberger's when he was younger so I could have had him tested. Please don't just rely on the online tests - trust your gut instincts and seek professional help for your son. I could have saved my son from a ton of hurt and trouble had I known.

It is not the schools responsibility it is the parents. Have your pediatrician recommend a psychiatrist that can evaluate your son. Once he has been evaluated and diagnosed you go back to the school with that and form an IEP.

Just an FYI my kids with ADD or ADHD never choked or hit. My son with PDD has. Every one of my kids are very intelligent they have no self control. Well except the one, she is strange. Be prepared that you son may have an Autism spectrum disorder and not ADHD.

Not sure why you asked for parents with older kids. My older two are 21 and 23, the 21 year old is the strange girl. Then we have 12 and 10 the 12 being the one with Autism spectrum.

It is not socially acceptable to hit or punch, kids with ADD have just enough social skills to get that one, once you fall on the Autism side they do not they have to be taught.

K.,
You need to be obsessive about no TV, no electronics. Zero. ADHD is going to feed off that. Remove it and you remove a lot of the 'back and forth' arguments.

he can't control himself yet. he doesn't belong in school. he doesn't need a label. he needs quiet attentive family. He will 'miss school' but he misses you and family more.

Don't expect a lot before age 7 - he's still growing and his body is focusing on that. maybe a suspension would be the best for HIM.

food may be an issue. friends have children with autism & ad/h/d and have tried gluten free - to find their child has a gut flora issue - or celiac or other issue. and the difference on changing diet is palpable.

time out done incorrectly leads to anti-social behavior. on top of adhd, do you need this too? does he need to learn this as a life skill? TALK to him. He won't know what is bothering him - why he choked another child - but he will know you are, and eventually try to pin down his emotions & feelings.

and you might have to teach him about feelings! You might have to emote and tell him. you might have to talk to him - you are angry right now. and leave it at that. identification is key - and learning it when you are off the charts for a label is harder - and you BOTH need to know how to use the information.

book: you are your child's first teacher - rahima baldwin dancy
attachment parenting .org - taught and is teaching me so much. it is HARD to go against what everyone else tells you - and then try to fix it the way they tell you. it is much much easier to use human nature and natural responses.

It is natural to hug a child who just 'misbehaved'. Because they are acting out due to a lack of what they need - not what you think they need.

solitary confinement is ending his childhood - and starting him hardening towards yourselves and everyone in general.

api.org is such a valuable resource for me. I hope you find it.

Good luck,
M.

I would start with your pediatrician. ADHD alone does not account for aggressive behavior. If I were you, I would seek out a developmental pediatrician in your area and have a full work up done. Once you have an expert "rule in" and "rule out" certain things, you'll be better equipped to go back to the school with the appropriate requests for accommodations or an IEP.

My husband and oldest son have ADHD and what you're describing doesn't really fit entirely. That's not to say that ADHD won't be a piece of the puzzle, but it's probably not the whole story.

The point is, the school can test for and accommodate learning problems (learning disabilities, speech and language problems, areas like hand strength or coordination that can benefit from OT, visual processing problems). School cannot diagnose or treat or even address ADHD - that's a medical problem. They can accommodate the medical problem just as they would something like vision impairment, hearing loss or diabetes, but it's up to you to have the medical problem diagnosed by a medical professional. Your son has what appears at least on the surface to be a behavioral problem and schools cannot test for or treat those. Again, if you present them with a diagnosis that could benefit from accommodations they can handle that, but not the diagnosis itself or even the primary treatment.

Please don't downplay your child's aggression as you did in your SWH. Choking a child hard enough to leave marks isn't typical behavior or something that kids do while horsing around. You have to work with your pediatrician to figure out what's going on and help him.

ETA: great that you're going ahead with calling your pediatrician. If available, I would ask for a referral to a Developmental Pediatrician. Those really are the experts at looking at a child and assessing problems that might be physical and/or psychological in nature.

In the meantime, check out the book The Kazdin Method for Parenting Your Defiant Child. I think you'll find some techniques there that will be helpful in the interim. The books is wonderfully specific with step-by-step instructions to follow when working on changing a particular behavior. Good luck with this - it's so frustrating to know that something is "off" but not know exactly what. Having my son (and my husband) properly diagnosed was the beginning of being able to *do* something.

You may want to homeschool him until you can get this under control. There may not be a simple answer here. You can see if food allergies is a factor here or maybe he'll change when he's older and more mature. Definatley keep up with discipline.

EDIT: I was just remembering my friend had a similar problem and her son was diagnosed with Asperger's. I'm not sure how common this is or if it's even a possibility but it's worth looking into. Good luck!

Has he been tested for AD(H)D? If not, sooner is better than later. My youngest, now 11, has it and knowing what was going on has been wonderful. She's been working with her therapist for 3+ years now and we are really seeing a difference. We decided to medicate at a very low level recently as well, since pre-puberty seemed to kick it into higher gear. The lowest med level has had no sideeffects for her, but has made all the difference in school.
I encourage you to meet this head on. Have the testing done by someone you trust, then you can decide who to tell and what to do. It has really helped us remember that it is not that she can control herself and won't, but that she really wants to control herself and can't. That makes all the difference in the world.

I'm sorry you are going through this. I have no idea about the discipline in your house, but if you have been consistent with him and engaged with him in dealing with his behaviors, then I really think that you need professional help.

ADHD CAN cause children to act this way. Impulsive behaviors and not seeing past their nose to the consequences is a hallmark of it.

I have seen a kid who stabbed another with a pencil turn into a model student with medication. Not every child responds well to medication, but for those who do, it's a godsend. I don't believe that every child with ADHD needs to be on meds, but if your child is going to be sent home from school and is choking other children, you really NEED to go that route, or you will end up homeschooling him.

He needs to learn to be around other children, and homeschooling will not teach him that. There is nothing wrong with homeschooling, but if you aren't of the mind to do that, go get him professional help.

With a diagnosis from the doctor, you can put a behavior modification program in place. Between that and the medication, and clear and swift consequences that are spelled out, you might be able to keep him in school.

Ask if there is a play therapist who can help you put together a behavior chart with you and your son, with everything spelled out as to what happens if he misbehaves. With a lot of clarity, using things that work enough for him to not say "so what", might help you have some success.

I feel for you mom. The school cannot have a child who is a danger to others, but your son needs a chance to change. I hope that all concerned can give him that chance.

In closing, I URGE you to take away the video games until he is MUCH OLDER. Talk to the psychologist about this. I believe he or she will tell you that playing these games is detrimental to his brain right now. I am NOT saying this about children in general. I AM saying this about a child with ADHD who engages in destructive and impulsive behaviors because of the way these games engage the brain.

Good luck,
Dawn

Have you actually requested that school perform any behavioral evaluations, formally? If not, do so. You shouldn't have to stamp your feet, but you should make a formal request in writing. I had to request any evaluation that was done. As for the doctor, if he has not performed any evaluation, that's got nothing to do with developing normally. I would pass right over the pediatrician and go right to a pediatric neurologist, who is a specialist in these disorders and will perform much more comprehensive evaluations than a pediatrician.

As a mom with a 6yo son who was diagnosed with ADHD and SPD (Sensory processing disorder) back in January, I would suggest you get a referral from your pediatrician to see a pediatric neurodevelopmental specialist. They will spend about an hour with you discussing issues, while they have your child perform "tests" without you present. Then they will bring the child into the room with you and the doctor and have them perform more tests while you are present (about an 1 1/2 hours more). If there is a diagnosis, you will receive a copy immediately with some recommendations. Once you have this contact the school to speak with the school child study team or psychologist (whichever the school has). You will have to fill out some forms to approve the school to bring in certified analysts. Your child will meet with several different specialists. They will write up reports. Using that coupled with the initial diagnosis received from the doctor, you can put an IEP (individualized educations plan) in place for your child. This plan can include things like sitting in certain locations of the class, frequent breaks if needed, standing during lessons, pull out for any kid of OT, etc. Just a fair warning, this process will take several months. As I stated my son was evaluated in Jan 2011 and we did not have the IEP with services in place until the end of April 2011 (and that was because we had him in a private school where they did the evaluation before the diagnosis). Also note, if you do the evaluation before the diagnosis (since he is in public school) they may say he "fails" for services until you get the diagnosis. Please feel free to reach out to me if you have any other questions about the process. The school my son was in (a private daycare with an accredited kindergarten) was very helpful and held my hand thru most of the process (since I was clueless), so I would be happy to help where I can. Good luck!!

I think I would start by talking to his pediatrician and also get some suggestions from the school. What does the school/teacher suggest so far? I am sorry you are going through this - it is frustrating and I know at the core you are worried for your son's well being. Just take it one day at a time and seek out advice. Also, maybe be sure to catch him doing the right things you list above - "how considerate you are to ask if Daddy's ok", "thanks so much for asking how my day was, it makes me happy you want to know". Reward the positive and put the focus on that.... what we focus on we get more of??? Maybe. Best of luck and hang in there.

The thing about testing kids at this age for any of these disorders (or gifted for that matter) is that their IQ's as well as their emotional behavioral components are still rapidly changing. I am firmly against diagnosing any child with any of these disorders at an age younger than 7, 6 at the earliest because of how unstable their scores are at this age.

Is he sociable in school with other children (not just at home, I mean). Does he actively play with other kids? You said that he plays with one or two children really well. But what happens when the group gets bigger?

How does he process information? Does he seem to take a while to think through tasks like washing his hands, art projects, etc? Does he avoid certain activities, saying he just doesn't want to do them or that they are too hard? If this is the case, he may be processing information a little bit slower and needing extra time to think through sensory stuff so that adding more than one or two extra kids to the mix requires him to process more information at one time than he can at this point. This would quickly cause him to act out if he feels overwhelmed with all of the info coming at him. Not saying SPD, just wondering if he's a little weak here.

Could be gifted. Gifted kids are often misdiagnosed for ADHD (activity component) and/or Asperger's (sociability component) when they are just really bored or none of their peers understand what they want to talk about. So it comes across as a disorder rather than a gift. Gifted kids often don't want to stay on task because they don't see the point - there are more important things to think about!

OR, he may be gifted and ADHD. The two often times go hand in hand (as well as Asperger's and some other disorders). This is called twice exceptional.

Just some thoughts as I work with my own speech delayed 5 yo DS who is doing math at a first grade level and can replicate large bits of music like Phantom of the Opera on the piano after listening for a time. He also can read three letter words (but not sentences yet). He was hitting quite a bit over the summer and after some speech therapy and pragmatic intervention (training on how we interact with our peers), he is doing much better with children. We maintain him in speech 4 times a week right now, though, and have him with an OT once a week to strengthen his ability to process info a bit faster.

Perhaps your kiddo needs some pragmatic intervention from a SLP trained in that.

Your son has a behavioral problem. He is doing well academically. The school district is required to test and treat conditions that result in the child's inability to succeed academically. You son is doing well academically. He has a behavior issue which may or may not be due to ADHD.

His difficulty with behavior is certainly not caused exclusively with being ADHD. Children with ADHD do not choke another child. They have difficulty focusing on school work and completing tasks. What you're seeing may be a result of inappropriate management of his behavior. That is not the school's responsibility.

Yes, they can assist you with behavior management in school but academics is their responsibility.

Once you have a diagnosis and treatment plan through your private providers they will participate in ways of managing him so that he will be better able to behave appropriately.

Start with your pediatrician and ask to be referred to a developmental pediatrician for testing. Your insurance may cover this.

My grandson was tested and provided specific treatments because of delayed speech. His behavior became out of control. The school (classroom teacher and school social worker) worked on improving his behavior with the usual techniques that work. But his behavior did not improve.

His mother took him to a developmental pediatrician and the help he's getting thru his insurance plan is an adjunct to the help he's getting thru the school district. He's in the school's program because he cannot speak, initially. He's still in the program because he's behind in academics.

My granddaughter has an education plan based on the combination of ADHD and poor academics. The school did not test her. They accepted her pediatrician's assessment. It's the academics that drives the plan. She was having difficulty learning because of the ADHD.

I hope you can comprehend the difference. J B described the difference very well. I sympathize with you. Your son's behavior is not only out of control but dangerous. Please take him to the pediatrician and get help for his behavior.