Help! ...weaning, Co-sleeping, Naps, Breast-dependency, Positive Discipline

Hi A.,
Good for you for continuing to nurture your son despite our backwards societal pressures. I honestly wouldn't listen to a doctor for advice on breastfeeding or parenting beyond medical advice. Most doctors aren't extensively trained enough to give such advice and, honestly, you are probably already more knowledgeable and experienced in the subject than he/she is. I stopped discussing breastfeeding with my doctor when she advised us to wean at her 1-year check-up. If only she knew dd was sustained breastfed and self-weaned on her own at 7 years. Her bedtime nursing was the last to go. She sounds very much like your son. She needed to nurse to sleep and would often nurse for an hour or more (we co-sleep). I too would just enjoy some good books or just rest my mind. (Stay away from the What to Expect series though, those totally messed with my attachment parenting mind.)

Your son is still very young to sleep through the night without nursing but you can try encouraging him by telling him that mom and dad need to sleep until the sun comes up. I eventually told my daughter this and it usually worked once she was ready for it. She marathon-nursed to sleep (always) and usually would not nurse again until sunrise (then she would marathon nurse again, ha). With compassionate parenting comes a compassionate child. I think there is not a more wonderfully secure way for a child to go to sleep at night than by nursing in the cozy arms of her mother.

And what a wonderful opportunity you have to raise a caring compassionate son who will one day have that same respect and understanding for his wife when she nurses her own child. =)

It sounds like you have a lot of mama sense and listen to your heart and your child's needs. I would encourage you to continue trusting yourself (and your child). It may seem like an eternity right now but it really does pass in the blink of an eye. You won't remember all the tasks you didn't complete but you will remember (and cherish) the nurturing moments with your son.

I was in a similar situation as far as breastfeeding and sleeping in the same bed. If you want to continue breastdfeeding except at night what I did was, although it was rough, I got up whenever my daughter wanted the breast in the middle of the night and made rice cereal or something of that nature and then put her back down with me to sleep. She didn't like having to put in the effort to acutally sit up in bed and eat so that lasted only 3 or 4 days and she was no longer eating through the night. However she still sleeps with us because I cannot handle the cry it out approach. Hope this helps. Good luck.

Dear A.,
By your request I am not sure if you are looking for advice, or just someone to validate the fact you are using attachment parenting with Ben. So how about I tackle this one with a little grace and discuss both sides of the spectrum. Although, I commend the style of parenting you are using with your sweet Ben, what I am concerned mostly about, is the fact your spouse is getting fustrated. And when you say positive discipline, I don't know what that means. Weaning is not a discipline issue, but a step to growth for Ben. Just like how a child needs to learn how to crawl, before he walks, or a child needs to learn how to not get along, before he learns to get along with his peers, weaning is the same idea. Now demand feeding as it is called is what you are doing, what about making it a goal to only demand feed during the day, so that at night it does not affect you and your husbands maritial life. I try to remind myself, that a child needs what lets say 1000 cal. a day. Now we have a choice to give those calories slowly and consistently through the day and teach our kids that nightime is for sleeping. Think about it for us adults would we get us through the night to eat. Kids are smart, but it will take sometime to adjust what he has been accumstumed to. Good luck.
Leesa

So relieved to know there's someone out there who shares the same experience as me. As I like to think, this stage is only temporary and it too, will pass (I hope). My 9-month old daughter also sleeps with my husband and I and isn't yet sleeping through the night. She also nurses whenever she wants to and often uses my breast as her pacifier.
My husband also has a hard time with all the night-time wakeups, and I must admit, it's not exactly easy on me, either since I can't sleep comfortably with my little one latched on.
I realize the sleeping arrangement isn't working well for us, though I have to admit I enjoy having my daughter by my side.
If you try something that works, I'd love to hear about it.
good luck!

F.
Upland, Ca.

I know just how it is! I also nursed my 3 girls each until they were about 2 years old. With each of them there came a point when I knew I needed to night wean because of such dependancy on the breast to sleep. I know a few things: Ben is definitely old enough to go all night without nursing in terms of calories, so you can feel at ease in that respect, and no weaning goes well unless you, mama, are 100% behind it. If you waffle, or worry that it's too hard for him, he will sense that there is wiggle room and it will go much harder.
So what you do is talk to him about it clearly " you know what, Ben? Now that you are getting to be such a big boy, mama's boobies don't make milk at night any more!" or "we only nurse when the sun is out" or what ever works for the two of you. And you start something else for going to sleep, rubbing his back, singing a song, reading a story, that becomes the ritual. As far as the waking up at night, I think you do have to suffer through at least 3 nights of him adjusting, and there may be a lot of crying. This is where you have to hold really firm, because there will be moments when it would definitely be easier to just nurse him! I wore a jogbra during those nights so my breast wasn't even accessable ( my kids were in bed with us for 4 years each!) And if your husband is really on board, he can help so much with the soothing while you get through this period. But you want to minimize what he's getting in terms of fuss in the night, so he doesn't come to rely on other soothing-- you want him to sleep longer on his own! And he will. good luck!

i have a happy, healthy 2 year old who still nurses to sleep most of the time, but recently night weaned. this has helped me tremendously as all night nursing was just making me feel crazy. first, i talked to him about it a lot before telling him that the nursies need rest now at night, so we aren't going to nurse until the sun comes up. the first night, he cried and i cried and i had to keep reminding myself that, although it's different, he also cries when he doesn't get a cookie and i'm ok with that. i didn't cave and the next night was easier. it took three nights for him to sleep through the night and now he occasionally still asks for nursies, but when i remind him to wait until the sun comes up, he waits patiently. i couldn't do this until his molars came in, however. he wasn't really ready before this and every time i tried, i would end up giving in. your son is lucky to have a thoughtful and caring mama as you are. good luck with whatever you decide to do.

You might want to check out "The No-Cry Sleep Solution for Toddlers and Preschoolers". It covers (I think, I haven't had a free moment yet to verify this!) night-time weaning, naps, sleeping through the night, etc. It's worth a shot--and Elizabeth Pantley is very much a "gentle" discipline person. Good luck--and let me know if it works, I'm struggling with my own 13 mo daughter.

Dear A.,

I'm on Dad's side. You two got yourselves into this, and you'd better talk about a strategy to get it stopped. You'd better do it now, night time is mommy and daddy time so get busy on it.

No, it won't be easy, but you've got to win this one. My gr grand daughter, 9 months old, is trying to type this for me . She is so smart and is just getting into crawling and pulling and pushing herself around the floor. So cute.

Good luck, C. N.

I read a book called The No Cry Sleep Solution. I can't remember the author's name but I'm sure you can google it. The author co-sleeps and is an advocate of attachment parenting, which sounds like your inclination. She has a "system" for nipple removal when nursing to sleep, and she helps with the transition from nurse induced sleep to sleeping on her own. Very child friendly book with lots of support and advice. The thing that was especially helpful for me was the reassurance that compassionately teaching a child to fall asleep on his/her own is a process, and that it takes time and sensitivity, but that it can be done! My second sweetheart is due in February and I'll be purchasing another copy...I've given my copies away!
Good Luck!

(oh, i just saw that jay gordon has already been suggested.....) in any case he has a great approach to night weaning if you feel like you have to do it - here is the page specifically on night weaning: http://www.drjaygordon.com/development/ap/sleep.asp
good luck!

Please don't stress out over this! In hindsight you'll remember this time with fond memories.

I nursed my daughter till her 3rd birthday. And, btw, we still HAPPILY co-sleep with her. Don't let other people's disapproving comments influence you from doing what you feel is right.

My daughter was exactly the same as far as nursing goes. About 2 months before her 3rd birthday, I started to talk to her about weaning. I explained that we were going to stop nursing, but that didn't mean that we couldn't snuggle. The morning of her 3rd birthday I reminded her. She cried and I gave in and nursed, but that night I asked her to try it. I held her and she fell asleep. This went on for a few days, but she got used to it without if being much trouble. She hasn't done it since. We still talk about it and she tells me that she misses it sometimes. Our reward is seeing her attitude towards mom's who are nursing and also pretending to nurse her dolls.

Remember, this time will go by fast, but the way you raise him will shape his attitude towards women and parenting for the future.

Good luck!

hi A.,
looks like you need some help. I am a first time mom too, with a 16mo old son. First sugestion is to buy Healthy Sleep Habits, Happy Child by Marc Weissbluth, M.D. this may help with some questions. This book help me with some questions I had. Also, you need to start trying to feed your son with a bottle. Try it during the day a little at a time to see if he'll take it. If he takes to it right away, switch to bottle feeding at night too. This should help with the breast-dependency. The more you can get him to drink from the bottle the easier the weaning will be, then you can wean from the bottle to sippy cup. Your son should be drinking out of a sippy cup now. I'm not sure if he already does. If so, you can also give him a sippy cup of milk at night. That is how I got my son to switch from bottle to cup at 12mos.
For the bed issue, try laying down maybe two receiving blankets on your sons crib bed so he can feel a little worm and comfy. And then try to see if he can sleep in it for a nap. Then at bed time start a routine with him. My son and I have a routine that works. Bath time, bed time story and a prayer bear, say goodnight to dad, have him turn out the lights, and sing (or sing & rock) him to sleep, lay him down in his crib and last but not least play a classical cd. You can even play Miracle cd by Celine Deon that works too. Even put his favorite bear in the crib in with him. It might take some time & he'll probably get up a couple of times but it should work.
Good Luck. S.

I don't know if many people have responded to you or not. This is my first time on mamasource and it immediately directed me to your question letter. I probably wouldn't have responded, but your story is exactly what we just went through. So I thought that I would give you a little encouragement.
Our son is 20 months old now and I was planning on breastfeeding at least until he was 2 years old. I had read that breastfeeding while pregnant is fine and believe that it is. So, we went ahead and got pregnant with our second and I am now beginning my sixth month of pregnancy. Our Dr. was adamant about weaning since our first son was born a little premature and I am therefore considered "high-risk". It took about a month of "avoiding" situations where I would have previously breastfed during the day and introduced bottles of soymilk and diluted juice instead. I thought that he would go crazy and he was unusually whiny for about a week. But I didn't drop the night-time feedings, so he adjusted quicker than I expected. I tried to do fun things with him to get his mind off of the adjustment, like taking him to the park etc. He also sleeps with us and after dropping all of the day-time feedings I was then thinking that sleep was going to be a nightmare if I dropped those. So, another month went by before I even considered it. However, since I dropped the day-time feedings my breasts quickly adjusted to not producing milk and it got to the point where Asher was just feeding in the night for comfort. I was listening and could tell that he was not swallowing at all. After all of this adjustment, he just fell asleep in my arms one night, which was totally unusual, but he had really begun to take in all of his fluids during the day, so he was fine etc. When he woke up at about 3 am to comfort feed, I just held him tightly on my chest and let him fall back asleep. We let him "cry it out" as I held him, which only lasted for about 2 or 3 minutes--he was only half awake anyway, so it didn't really disturb us at all. After that, it was a few days of fussiness at around 3 am and 6 am etc. but he was getting used to being held and would quickly fall back asleep. It's been two weeks now and I can't believe what great sleep we're all getting! It was fine before, but as you know, I would wake up for all those feedings etc. and though I was really sad to quit at first, I realize now that I needed a break before it all starts again in May!! (Also, one of the first nights that he was fussy, I told my husband to just go sleep on the couch, since he had school the next day. But it only happened once and only for a few hours.)Asher has totally adjusted and is quite happy now. There were only a few rough spots and they were not long. So, I would say that with all of the close attention your son receives from you, he will quickly adjust to your efforts to develop more independence--whatever way works out! I would say though, that with whatever you choose to do, the number one thing is to be consistent, otherwise, he will end up being confused. Hope it goes well! --------B.

My daughter is a first time mother. She also, is still breastfeeding. Still lets my grand-daughter sleep with her. My grand-daughter can not be with out her mother in her sight. If she is out of the room, she will whine for a little. I, having 5 kids of my own, had not ever done that. I beleive that they need to be on their own, in their own bed. You will still have the bond between you, you need your time with your husband in your bed. I beleive that spoiled kids, will be bratty kids. My kids have manners and respect other adults. Think about what the pediatrition tells you. You will get more sleep and your husband will enjoy having you to himself in bed.

Weaning is a sensitive subject to most of us moms and there are certainly a variety of opinions on how to or not to do it. I have two children; one was a fairly good sleeper and one was a horrible sleeper who wanted to nurse constantly for comfort rather than for hunger.

Nursing doesn't have to stop at this point but you may want to limit the number of times it happens in the day or night. He may be asking to nurse for comfort rather than hunger all the time. At his age, your son is definitely old enough to learn some of his own soothing techniques. And, it does not take him an hour to nurse; his actually feeding time, especially if he nurses often, is probably more like five minutes. He is using you like a pacifier. Limit his nursing time by delatching him gentle using your thumb and forefinger and releasing the suction from your breast. You can caress and snuggle with him reassuring him that mama is near without having your breast in his both all the time.

During the day, if he is well fed and still insists on nursing, I would try gentle ways of distracting him with toys, play, or a trip outside. He is probably just tired and wants snuggle time. If he isn't eating solids yet, introducing him to some solid foods would be beneficial to both of you. Sleep time may require something else to love such as an stuffed animal or blanket with a gradual transfer process. And, at some point, you will need to put him in a separate bed and leave him alone for short periods of time coming in to reassure him and then leaving again. I realize you live in a studio apartment so this may mean just stepping into the bathroom or outside the front door for a bit. It will take time and he will have to cry some during the adjustment process. Daddy also needs to spend some time in the nuturing part of the relationship so that your son can see that he can receive affection from both of you.

It can be temporarily heartbreaking but it is for his growth and development process and well as the good of your marriage and family.

Aloha A.,

What a sound familiar story.... of ours! I am a mother of 4 years old daughter. My beginning of Mom life was pretty much like yours. I weaned my daughter out completely on her 3rd birthday. It was a great nursing life :-) From my personal experience, You do not need to rush weaning her off because of this habit. Many people has their own opinion. Then you should keep yours, too. If you are enjoining "Natural" way of parenting, You should go for it. I have a few grown up friends those are nursed until age of 4 or 5. They are fine, mature young people. Bonding is very important at the early age.

My daughter liked to fall a sleep while she was nursed. It took a while to break that habit. It just take patience.

The process was like this...

I stopped laying down with her to nurse and let her fall asleep. Nursing was done while I was sitting on couch. She did fall a sleep on my arm. Her sleep pattern was shallow. I needed to be very careful to unlatch her. I use a method of gently squeeze my wet finger in to her mouth. When my finger was in her mouth, I pulled my nipple and finger away. At the beginning, she awoke, cry and ask for a real thing. Many time, I was tempted to just give it in. But, that is not a good idea. You got to be tough when you attempt to break sweet habit of your baby. I was in search for what would sooth her other than being nursed.

One day, while she was in my arm crying, I took her to outside. Immediately, she started to calm down. I rocked her with fresh air for a while. Then she fell a sleep deep. Now, I was able to put her down on her futon and leave her. At the age of 4, she still prefer to go out side, get a fresh air and calm down when she is upset.

I think that you just need to find the other way of sooth your sweet baby boy. There should be something else it works for both of you. Rock, sing, wisper, tight hug, ..... It got to be something else for him! And, it is not impossible to break a habit. It may not happens in a day. But it will. You can find it. You are a loving Mom.

Good luck!

PS. Yes, When I decide to say Good bye Nursing, I had a chat with my daughter. I told her that "When you become 3, that is the day you say "Bye-bye" to Mommy's boobie" First few weeks was tough. I kept telling her that " You are 3. No more Mommy's milk." At the age of 4, she still look at my breast with a big smile when we take a bath together.

Just because your pediatrician suggests something does not mean it is the best way to go. Your situation sounds a lot like my youngest, who is 8 years old now. You are committed to natural parenting - that is fantastic! Stick with it! Don't wean now. At 15 months he is beginning to feel his own autonomy, and he obviously needs the comfort and closeness of frequent nursing at night. My husband did not wake up during night nursing, so I didn't have a frustrated hubby to deal with, but as for me, I barely woke up for night feedings myself. He was laying right next to me and he just latched on, did his thing, and fell right back to sleep. As for the chores not getting done - not an issue in the overall scheme of things. The closeness you are building now is priceless. He will never be a sweet, precious, 15 month old again. All too soon he will be a 15 year old. You will have plenty of time for chores when you are up half the night worrying about him during his teen years. :0)

A.,

I've so been there. Since your post is from mid December, I'm curious if things have worked out for you? I'll be brief in case you are over getting anymore advice.

My first, who is now 5. Nursed until she was 25mos old, I was 5 mos pregnant and not producing any milk. Nursing really hurt and like yours, she nursed throughout the night and had to stay latched during naps. A little easier when she was all that I had at the time. She was a bit older than yours but my Ped. (we go to Sears Pediatrics, so obviously they are going to be pro-breastfeeding) suggested that I talk to her, explain to her that my milk is gone and my boobies hurt. Two nights of this and the 3rd night, she wouldn't nurse, she told ME that the milk is all gone. It was amazing, I wouldn't have believed it if it didn't actually happen to me. With my second, he is almost 3 and still nurses although not very often. I stopped the night time nursing at about, gosh, I can't remember but shortly after turning 2. With him I told him when Mr. Moon is out we don't nurse. I would also tell him my boobies were sleeping. This took months but eventually he was fine with it and to this day, sleeps with us on most nights but doesn't ask to nurse during the night. In fact, both he and my daughter are great sleepers and sleep all night. My advice doesn't help you so much with a 15mos old, but I tell you my two stories so maybe you can plant the seed in him now, gradually telling him no more nursing when it is dark out, etc.. whatever you wish of course! Another thing that helped with my second - was my husband helped out when he could. He was always able to get my son to sleep, whereas I was only able to nurse him to sleep. Maybe if yours isn't already doing that, you could give that a try. They seem to know that Daddies don't have the good stuff and will settle for a little rocking or patting down to sleep. Good luck to you! Nice to see some other AP Mama's in this group!

It's good to know there are other co-sleeping, breastfeeding, natural parenting nuts out there! Sometimes I marvel at how few of us there seem to be in a city that appears to be so "progressive"!

Anyhoo... have you tried "Good Nights" by Dr. Jay Gordon? There is a section in there about night weaning and it's very gentle and you can bow out at any point if your little one is too unhappy and then retry later. Dr. Gordon is our pediatrician and he's all about co-sleeping, extended nursing, home birth, etc., so I think you'd be in great hands if you followed his method.

Good luck!

try discussing it with him. I'm sure he knows the word 'no' right? start telling him you're going to begin stopping the breast feeding and accompany it with sign language that you make up. bring it up a couple time a day aand not always at feedings. you may be surprised at how quickly the transition may be. don't forget that YOU and your husband are still in charge. use a comfort item like a silky or paci. that he can suck on other than you breast before you start the transition, then offer that item when he wants to nurse at nite...keep offering it first before you give the breast...good luck!

Hi! First off, co-sleeping is a great choice. I have two boys that slept with us on a regular basis since birth. Everyone told me it was gonna backfire, that I would never get them out of my bed...but they were wrong. What I have are two very affectionate boys at 8 and 10 that love to cuddle. A lot of boys that age don't and I really credit it to the "family bed". They still crawl in with us when they have nightmares or wake up too early...and I love it!

A warning: I breastfed my second son for 13 months. I quit breastfeeding because I was pressured to do so. I sincerely regret it. Don't listen to other people, follow you heart. That said...I allowed him to breastfeed throughout the night...i didn't even wake up for it. When his first molars came in at 15 months (that's early) there were gray spots in the middle of all 4. When I finally found a dentist to take him that young I was told it was because I breastfed through the night. It's ok as long as you wash out their mouth after each feeding (but who does that in the middle of the night?). He is 8 now. Those original 4 molars all had to be pulled out when he was 5 because the decay was so extensive so fast. It was horrible seeing him go through that.

As to your weaning at night problem...have you tried sleeping with a bra and fitted shirt on? Maybe you could keep the girls on actual "lock down" and pretend like you don't know he wants them. Maybe feign sleeping? He may just fall back asleep.

Hope this was useful!

Dear A.,

La Leche League taught me a technique of very gently sliding a pinkie finger into the corner of baby's mouth to "pop" her off the nipple. Do it *very* gently (obviously) and hold her closely to you for several minutes so she doesn't feel the effects of missing you, then set her down gently.

From fellow weirdo!

My daughter slept with us as well until she was 2 and I weaned her. I actually left and went to Hawaii for 10 days to do it since she was so attached to me. Peds will tell you to wean at 12m because that is what they do and husbands, well they will tell you right away LOL. My daugher did the same thing your son did although everyone said it was wrong. But it worked for us. So hang in there and if you really want to wean I would suggest going away for a few days.

A., Weaning breastfead children can be a challenge but doable! I breastfed my son until he was 18 months old and currently nurse my 8 month old daughter. To wean I have 2 suggestions. The first is to establish that your breasts are yours and while it is a wonderfull bonding and healthy expierence your baby has to know that nursing is for nourishment and not to pacify on you. The older he gets the stronger his habbits will get. Does he suck anything else? His thumb or a pacifier? I would nurse him at a more scheduled time, then rock him or try another sleeping ritual. If you start taking away nursing slowly by skipping all the in between times that are not for eating purposes it will be eaiser on both of you! And bonus, maybe you and your husband can have your bed back! Try to introduce new sippy cups and get excited so he will be excited. Maybe you can take him shopping for some. Good luck and don't give up!